Orlando Bloom中文站论坛

标题: 天国带签名新照+国外fans评论（附我的转载授权） [打印本页]

作者: 风语冰音 时间: 2004-4-2 19:00
标题: 天国带签名新照+国外fans评论（附我的转载授权）
（插一段我的转载授权声明：凡是我以风语冰音的名字发表在魔戒中文站、obbbs和晋江文学城上的帖子，均允许转载到任何正当的、非营利性的网站上，不必再询问我，方便的话贴完后给我个网址就行，我希望更多的人了解正确的信息，不要被国内不负责任的媒体误导。
在此三网站内，我只在其中一个版块留言，不重复发帖，如有那位大人认为应转贴，请自行转载，不用告知。
如我在此三网站其中之一发帖，而其他两个未发，可在发帖12小时之后，转贴到其他两个网站上，因为我有时太忙，也许来不及都贴，谢谢大人们的支持！）

http://img27.photobucket.com/albums/v81/Catsbycat1/studiofr2_mar04.jpg

请点链接地址观看。
图下的字是法文，译成英文是：
The caption read: "Chosen especially for the occasion, this first photo from Kingdom of Heaven, that Ridley Scott currently films in Morocco and that Orlando Bloom dedicates for us."

Orlando 在照片上写的也是法文，译成英文是这样的：

"Happy Birthday, Studio" ( also can be translated as "Happy Anniversary" )
Studio (note: name of magazine)
Best Wishes
Orlando Bloom
X

应该是祝这本法文杂志生日快乐。

不过，我是看不懂，也不知道是不是这样。
orli写英文我都不清楚是什么，更别说是法文了。但是，国外的fans居然都说他写字写得好（汗ing......):
Did anyone else notice what beautiful handwriting he has? Very creative and scripty, unlike most men who are rather blockish with their writing. Orlando's is very elegant by comparison.  I'm not even going to TALK about it being in French.

I was thinking exactly the same thing - he has gorgeous handwriting. Nothing chicken-scratch about it...lovely flowing letters, little flourishes.... Even his darn handwriting gets to me!!!!

还有人说orlando会说法文，不过没有确实消息。

以下是一些外文论坛上关于这张照片的讨论留言，很有意思，值得一看，与国内的评论比较就更有意思了。
所有留言大意是说他看起来太好了，并为这个造型而激动兴奋，认为这将是个证明演技的好机会：（我没时间翻译了，但是很容易懂，大人们自己看看吧）
He does seem to have gained weight! beautiful！handsome！

The Dirty Man Knight!He keeps on lookin' better with age。

Despite the beauty of this...dirty man photo, I think we need to look past the allure of grubby Orlando and see that Balian will be the role to, maybe I shouldn't say push him into superstardom, but rather to irrevocably place him in the category of "serious" actors.

man he looks hot ... just Wow ...
He looks simply gorgeous! Scruff or no scruff, this man has got it going on!

So far all I can see is his forehead, which is actually very lovely, indeed!

Oh, can he get any more attractive? Sweet, generous, Dirty!Man!Knight? SO many men wrapped up into one perfect, dirty package.

MAGNIFIQUE! SUPERBE BEAU! All the French words in the world describing such manly beauty don't do justice-- he looks more seasoned & mature. I'll absolutely die waiting for the Kingdom to come if it wasn't for Troy.

Good Lord above! Was God ever in a great mood when He created this man! I think there's an old Alabama song that says something like, "God must have spent a little more time on you..." or something close to that anyway. That makes me think of Orlando.

How does he do it? How is it possible that he just looks better and better all the time?  And him writing in French? I can't even put together a coherent statement about that. I hate to think what I'd do if I ever heard french words come out of his mouth.
Gah, he looks so dangerous. Lethal. Edgy. Hot. Like he's just going to snap and slam somebody into a wall. I want fierce Balian so badly right now...

He looks beautiful and sexy and All. Grown. Up.

Molokai, your comparison is very apropos, just like fine wine, sweet and intoxicating, only getting richer and more delicious with age. How amazing that we have seen him go from boy to man, and do it with such grace and aplomb.

He looks amazing...so intense, and serious (not to mention drop dead gorgeous).

Is not this man amazing? He seems to be able to do it all. Not only is he drop dead gorgeous no matter how hard they try to "dirty him up"  , he is so talented, and.......he speaks French!
I'm gone. Entirely gone.

There's something about him in all the photos we've seen from Spain and now Moracco. Maybe it's that maturity thing. I think this role is going to be so amazing. There seems to be a confidence about him and a poise that is quite captivating. He really has grown into quite a splendid man. I think the character of Balian just captures his masculinity and the full scope of his manhood.

这时另一张美国杂志上的照片
http://web.singnet.com.sg/~chewgc/ob/star_apr04_01.jpg

[此贴子已经被作者于2004-4-3 19:10:41编辑过]

作者: 逍逍遥遥 时间: 2004-4-2 19:17
看不见~

作者: 睡觉的耳朵 时间: 2004-4-2 19:24
天哪~
怎么这么沧桑！！！

作者: 陌上草 时间: 2004-4-2 19:32
确实有些苍桑过头了，虽然够man~~怎么老演胡子多多的人呢。个人认为奥兰多趁年轻时真应该多演一些清纯美少年，man的角色以后有的是机会，而那份纯美青涩的扮相若干年后就不会有了。

作者: zq 时间: 2004-4-2 20:08
天哪，好象有50岁了！好沧桑啊！

作者: 浊酒 时间: 2004-4-2 22:14
五十岁,这有点夸张了
中外的审美眼光真是不一样,外国站上的FANS反而都夸这张BEAUTIFUL`~`

作者: 枝俏 时间: 2004-4-2 22:20
怎么觉的和阿汤在最后武士里造型特象呢

作者: Federica 时间: 2004-4-2 22:33
50岁？没那么夸张吧？我倒感觉这造型还不错，能接受。

作者: 浊酒 时间: 2004-4-2 22:38
本来天国就不是给十几岁小孩拍的电影啊,形像成熟些也是正理

汗,表过真有点烈士的意思了,看开花这大义凛然的水汪汪的眼神

传说天国中这角色会死

[此贴子已经被作者于2004-4-2 22:39:25编辑过]

作者: 枝俏 时间: 2004-4-2 22:45
终于S了

汗,我们等很久了

那么水灵的也真下的了手
真想见见那个人,厉害啊PF

作者: 浊酒 时间: 2004-4-2 22:51
俺强烈希望天国中开花扮演的人物S掉,表过,目前为止都是传说,是不是真S还不一定

继续严重希望

作者: 陌上草 时间: 2004-4-2 22:53
为了片子的效果，还是壮烈牺牲吧~史诗类的片子要凸显悲剧英雄用死亡结束是比较常见的选择（有时也是无奈的选择，不能篡改历史啊），勇敢的心，角斗士哪个主角不都死了，死得很悲壮也特别煽情。

作者: 浊酒 时间: 2004-4-2 23:00
十字军这事,以俺看真真是糊涂仗

开始时,至少对其中一方来说还有宗教上的追求
但集合了些杂七杂八的乌合之众后,就整个变了味

表过,电影是艺术再塑造

开花的角色最后来锅"英勇就义"也是极有可能

作者: 陌上草 时间: 2004-4-2 23:28
我对十字军东征（东侵）的历史不了解，在我初步的印象就是侵略，就我一惯的立场是不站在骑士团这方的。不过，看电影是肯定跟着男主角走了~~
期待着男主角的就义，如果结局是和公主从此过上幸福的日子才糟呢~

作者: 浊酒 时间: 2004-4-2 23:35
也没准最后真和公主过SWEET小日子去,虽说老SCOTT导演大爷不至于这么浪漫过度,但MM们的眼泪也不能小看

水淹天国

作者: 月月 时间: 2004-4-2 23:37
不知咋搞的偶真喜欢OB在《天国》里的造型，坐在电脑前都听得到自己的心跳声（彻底掉坑里了- -||），强烈要求导演同志应广大人民群众要求让某人英勇就义吧，让偶在影院里为了亲爱的他彻底哭一场。

作者: 浊酒 时间: 2004-4-2 23:46
和月月MM握手ING

俺也喜欢,尤其是这张,开花这眼神,任是无情也动人啊

昨天和一个MM看着这张口水,她说:啊,穿得是差些,可世上竟还有这么帅的小伙子在要饭

厚厚,笑S俺ING

[此贴子已经被作者于2004-4-2 23:47:17编辑过]

作者: 逍逍遥遥 时间: 2004-4-2 23:51
天啦，大家说得这么热闹。为什么就是我看不到！！！！

作者: zq 时间: 2004-4-3 00:31
别说,越来越觉得ORLI这张照片是英勇就义前的最后亮相了!呵呵呵!

作者: oo 时间: 2004-4-3 00:38

以下是引用陌上草在2004-4-2 19:32:30的发言：
确实有些苍桑过头了，虽然够man~~怎么老演胡子多多的人呢。个人认为奥兰多趁年轻时真应该多演一些清纯美少年，man的角色以后有的是机会，而那份纯美青涩的扮相若干年后就不会有了。

同意啊！

作者: 斯帝加尔拉 时间: 2004-4-3 11:16
TMD的到现在为止OB演的角色除了莱莱和Will其他不是死就是伤~~~~~~~~~~~~~

作者: 枝俏 时间: 2004-4-3 12:27
就义是我们的愿望

我们等着看他XX都等多久了!!

为了满足我们的心理

作者: lyra 时间: 2004-4-3 17:51
OB参加的是第几此十字军啊,说是演农民,8会是加入第一支十字军队伍吧,那叫一个惨,一群农民怀着完成伟大使命外加发财的目的浩浩荡荡出发后,发现才没有粮食供给,最后一路掠夺杀人放火,引起公愤,半路就溃不成军了

作者: Joe 时间: 2004-4-3 17:57
诶？？这个值得考证一下啊！！

不过做农民东征能到跟公主眉来眼去的份上想来也不算很惨！！不过看开花象拖布一样的乱草式发型，SCOTT爷爷是坚决贯彻了我们的虐开花的方针原则！赞~~~

作者: 风语冰音 时间: 2004-4-3 18:20
就我自己的看法，我非常喜欢这个造型。他的眼神和以往不同，深沉而坚毅，已经投入到了角色中，他也许不像之前的照片中那么干净整齐，但是对我来说却同样有吸引力，也因此更期待这部电影。

对于国内外有些不同的想法，个人就在几个论坛上获得的信息看，是有一些客观原因决定的：
首先，审美标准的不同，这跟文化、经历等有关，倒没什么可说的；另外，国内的fans大部分都是由魔戒和莱戈拉斯认识orli的，除此之外了解甚少，或是不喜欢他其他的造型，而国外的fans虽然也有大部分是有喜欢莱戈拉斯到喜欢orlando的，但是，由于媒体等报道多，对orlando有了很多了解，很多人很早已经喜欢orli，而把莱戈拉斯当作他演过的经典角色来看了，所以对他改变造型没有什么意见，而且有很多人是在看过《加勒比海盗》后才喜欢上orli的，所以人员构成和我们不太一样，随着时间的推移，外文论坛上喜欢orli和只喜欢莱戈拉斯的已经分化到不同网站上，不会有什么冲突；最后，可能年龄构成也有一定影响，国外网站年龄小的也很多，但更多的是已经成年的、工作的，更有很多30多岁有事业有家庭的中坚力量，所以看法比较一致也不奇怪。

看法没有谁对谁错，没必要非要每个人都喜欢这个造型，也没必要非说不好，反正orli有很多面貌，各自喜欢各自的就好了。

对我来说，他每一面都是吸引人的，我喜欢他所有的形象，我认为我是幸运的。

作者: 浊酒 时间: 2004-4-3 19:31
亲冰音MM一下~~
俺是OB的任何样子都喜欢那一类,不过,可能因为俺一向喜欢很MAN的男性形像的原因,对LEGGY这个精灵形像,俺是没什么大感觉
(喜欢精灵扮相的朋友看了别怒,这是俺的个人观点,也就是一面之辞,不必介意)
而现在天国中的这个形像,光以这个眼神论,就让俺花痴得表行啦~~
还用这句诗---任是无情也动人

笑, 以前相对来说,俺更爱逛外国的OB FANS站点,为什么呢?因为有'共鸣'
虽然俺的外语不是很灵光,但是,在想法上,更同意一些外国FANS站上的观点

可以说,外国FANS站上的OB同好,许多不只是因为这个年青男演员的外形而单纯的喜欢他,狂流成吉思汗----------虽然,许多人是因为外形而开始注意他

怎么说呢,比如KA--BLOOM那个站点,俺觉得在那里从电影和角色这方面来关注OB的人较多,其中人员虽也水平不均,但相对国内大部分TEENGIRL来说,他们对电影方面的认知度,再加上其中一些已成家立业的年纪较大的影迷的成熟的人生观
总体而言,在对事物的看法上讲,是更使俺认同的

花痴是不分等级的,但人和人始终是不同滴
物以类聚,人以群分
说句不中听的,这个OBBBS,相较俺以前混过的各种文学,影评或军事网站来说,平均水平(这含人员素质,知识面,电脑技术,年纪层次,人生观等诸多因素),它一开始给俺的感觉并不好
后来,来这玩的人越来越多,俺发现了这个新新新闻区板块,发现了几位和俺认识相同的好友,才真正在这落户安家,尼亚加拉瀑布汗-----------连俺自己的网站,俺都因在'此间乐,不思蜀"而几至忘却

就当俺老夫聊发少年狂吧,俺的意思如果让人反感,理解为俺自满过度,看不起和俺观点不同的小朋友,俺也不作过多解释
而明白俺话里意思的真正的同好,自不会误会

作者: yezi123 时间: 2004-4-3 19:57
好像ORLI在天国里的角色不会死哦。(看演到什么年代，如果一直演到他五十多岁去世那就是死了，但不会是战死的。)
他演的是个历史人物，史书上记有一笔的，是阿拉伯人大英雄萨拉丁将西方人赶出圣地前带领西方人守卫圣地的最后一个领导人。虽说最后带领全城投降了，但他为保住全城人民的性命立了功。西方人的观念不同，在一场注定失败的战斗面前(几乎没有了战士)，他们选择投降。如果ORLI能把握好这个人物，他会在好莱坞稳稳站住脚跟。(只是不知道剧本是不是如同历史那般悲壮。)

作者: 浊酒 时间: 2004-4-3 20:06
恩,谢谢MM提供的资料

不过,俺还是贼想看OB的角色英勇就义一把滴---俺这BT口味

其实在一场没有胜算的战争面前,与其用许多鲜血和生命来作孤注一掷的浪费,不如保全
生命才是最宝贵的,生命才是人类最高的尊严

作者: 风语冰音 时间: 2004-4-3 20:48
浊酒大人~~亲~~

你说的话简直是太对了，我举双手双脚同意！
我开始是在中文网站上逛，但是说实话，水平差距体现在各个方面。

我经常去大人说的那个网站，更新快，而且评论客观、具体，经常一说一大段，而且哪里人做的头像和签名档~~太美了！！
在给大人一个网址：http://elflady.com/orlandolove/index.php?sid=6c9f896bdb0b35ddf0d6857f44b7846b
人没有那里多，但是也不错的，头像和签名档~~同样精美极了！！

作者: 风语冰音 时间: 2004-4-3 20:51
对了，有一段关于这段历史的叙述，我本来想之后翻译了再帖，最近忙，先贴出来，大人们先看着，我过后再翻译：

So here we go again. If you know the basic story of Kingdom of Heaven, then you probably know the movie is based upon real events (well..sort of) and real people. Balian of Ibelin, Orlando's character, was a real person during the 12th Century A.D. and here's the place to learn more about him! I'm a research junkie, but if anyone has any information, please post it! (side note: I've been unable to find that speech that Balian delivered...if you have a copy, please post it here or PM me...thanks!!)

QUOTE
The defense of Jerusalem was organized by Balian of Ibelin. He had fought at Hattin and had escaped and gone to Tyre. But his wife and children were in Jerusalem. Balian asked for and received permission from Saladin to go to Jerusalem to fetch his family, on condition that he not remain there more than one night. Once he got to the city, though, the Patriarch and citizens begged him to stay. Balian wrote to Saladin to explain why he was breaking his agreement. Saladin, famous for his chivalry, not only forgave Balian, but provided Balian's family safe conduct back to Tyre.

The situation in Jerusalem was literally hopeless. There was a grand total of three knights in the entire city . . . counting Balian. For every adult male there were fifty women and children. Balian commandeered every bit of money he could find and armed every man, whether or not he knew how to fight. The Christians simply would not give up Jerusalem without a fight. They could always hope for a miracle--Crusader legends were filled with them.

Saladin arrived on September 20th. He spent a few days trying to decide where best to attack the city, for the great walls were now Jerusalem's best defense. The defenders fought well, but there was no reason to hope, unless the ground itself should swallow up the Muslim army, for there was no Christian army near or even far that could help. Only Saladin's reluctance to storm the city and initiate a massacre saved the defenders. On the 30th, Balian went out to negotiate.

Even as the battle proceeded, the two men talked. Balian was at least able to arrange terms, which were quite generous, given the situation. The city was to surrender unconditionally, but the Christians were allowed to buy their freedom: ten dinars for a man, five for a woman, one for a child. Seven thousand of the poor would be freed for a lump sum of thirty thousand dinars. Balian agreed.

The fighting stopped on October 1st; Saladin entered the city the next day.

http://crusades.boisestate.edu/Outremer/32.htm

作者: 浊酒 时间: 2004-4-3 21:16
谢谢冰音MM提供的网址~~~
那里是个"装修"很淡雅的站,俺喜欢~~

[此贴子已经被作者于2004-4-3 22:01:20编辑过]

作者: 风语冰音 时间: 2004-4-3 21:34
浊酒大人，这里还有一段文章，是Balian的讲话，实在是好。
国外fans都说这段话要使出现在电影中一定是经典片段，不知道会不会在电影中出现：

Balian then made one of the most inspired speeches in military history. It was recorded by Saladin's historian, Ibn al Athir:

Know then, O Sultan, that we are infinite in number and that God alone can guess what our number is.
The inhabitants are reluctant to fight, because they hope for quarter, such as you have granted to so many others. They fear death and cling to life; but once death becomes inevitable, I swear by the God who hears us, we shall kill our women and our children, we shall burn our riches and we shall not leave you a single coin.
You will find no more women to reduce to slavery, or men to put in irons.
We shall destroy the Dome of the Rock and the Mosque al Aqsa and all the holy places.
We shall slaughter all the Moslems, to the number of five thousand, imprisoned in our walls.
We shall not leave a single beast of burden alive.
We shall come out against you, and we shall fight like people fighting for their lives.
For one of us who perishes, many of yours will fall.

We shall die free, or we shall triumph with glory.

http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Academy/22...41/page100.html

作者: 浊酒 时间: 2004-4-3 21:46
啊,希望编剧和不让俺们开花洗头穿好衣服的SCOTT导演大伯把这话放台词中去

这要是作为台词,真是~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"For one of us who perishes, many of yours will fall."
想像OB说这句的语调

[此贴子已经被作者于2004-4-3 21:59:21编辑过]

作者: mursili 时间: 2004-4-3 22:09
原来世界上所有人种发花痴的方式都是一样滴……

看了那杂志的文了没有，垃圾，偶不相信！！

作者: 浊酒 时间: 2004-4-3 22:13
哪个杂志的文?

作者: lyra 时间: 2004-4-3 22:14
Balian应该就是Ibn Barzan了,下面是saladin秘书imad adin纪录的光复耶路撒冷的经过,8过既然法兰克人是他们的敌人,纪录敌人时肯定是带有一定偏见的
伊斯兰教历7月20日星期五。苏丹(saladin)来到北面扎营，围住法兰克人的通道，为他们敞开了通向死亡的道路。他安放好弹射器、以把灾难投向敌人
岩顶圆顶寺在石块投射下轰隆隆作响，敌军躲在城墙后。他们只要一到墙外来，将难逃一死，灵魂也要沉沦。圣殿骑士团吼叫不歇，贵族陷入地狱，医院骑士团交上了恶运，“修士们”必死无疑。
投掷的石块与目标物之间毫无屏障。在南北两面，欲望之火燃烧着众人的心灵，面孔任凭武器来亲吻。战斗的情绪扭曲着灵魂，双手紧握出鞘的剑柄。
人人抱怨风速太慢，不能把石块射入城中。这些从投射架上飞出去的石块，倾泻在墙脚下，打碎了墙上的雉谍。[…]
让火流星从天空落下，让岩石从地下喷出，让燃烧的木柴迸出火星！没有什么比得上由投射台而来的灾难，由那儿展现无坚不摧的奇迹，集中人力，发出炮弹射出的呼啸声，击中目标的轰隆声。[…]
敌人被打垮了，队伍四处溃散。我们越过壕沟发动进攻。伊斯兰教徒看到了胜利，非伊斯兰教徒面临着死亡。
缺口打开了，原来困难的事变得轻而易举。我们用上全部兵力，达成目标。顽固抵抗者非死即伤，防线攻破，战斗结束了。
我们所实现的目标超过预期，问题解决了。敌人害怕被消灭，个个失魂落魄，吓出病来。城市重归伊斯兰教；敌人的壕沟形成的地带被切断了。
这时Ibn Barzan出来要求苏丹开口，饶他部下一死。但是苏丹拒绝，并大声坚持己见：“我们既不保护也不宽恕你们！只希望你们永远处于卑劣的境地。明天，我们要用武力夺取城市，屠杀你们，俘虏你们。让你们的男人流血，妇孺沦为奴隶。”
因为苏丹不肯饶命，他们就低声下气，提醒他仓促决定将造成的后果：“如果我们活不了，畏惧您的权力而放弃一切希望；如果我们毫无出路，不得安宁，灵魂得不到拯救，也得不到宽恕和恩典的话，我们就要为自己的生命讨回公道。[…]”
“在受到打击之前，我们每一个人就要撂倒他们十个。侵略者的手还没抓住我们，我们就已经消灭了他们十次。我们要烧掉房子，摧毁神殿的穹顶，让你们为害我们沦为奴隶而深感耻辱。”
“我们要推倒岩顶圆顶寺，让你们尝尝失去它的痛苦。我们要杀死所有的伊斯兰教徒战俘，他们人数太多了。而且大家都知道，我们讨厌无耻的人，而崇尚荣誉。我们要毁掉财物，不留给你们；我们将杀死自己的孩子，让他们诅咒我们。您气量狭小，不答应我们的请求，就会失去一切利益，您又能得到什么好处呢？有多少幻灭不是来自对成就的期望，而痛苦只能靠和平来治愈！有多少人在黑暗里开始旅行，天亮前就在夜色中迷失了方向？”
于是苏丹召开会议，把打胜仗的指挥官找来，就这个问题征求他们的意见。他要点燃众人头脑里的灯火，看清他们的思想。他鼓励他们说出最适当的解决办法，一同讨论最有利的和平条件。[…]
经过无数次祈祷、会谈、遣使、哀求和说情，双方确定了一笔款项。我们非常满意得到担保。他们用这笔款项赎回财产，救出同胞。但若是有人逾40天还不能或不愿偿付的话，就要无条件变成我们的奴隶。价格定为男人十个金币，女人五个，小孩不论男女一律两个金币。伊本·巴尔赞、主教、圣殿骑士团和医院骑士团的首领充当担保人。伊本·巴尔赞为穷人付了三万金币，履行了诺言。凡
是付款的人随后自由离开家园，再也不会回来了。
价格订定以后，他们于伊斯兰教历27日星期五交出了城市。他们不得不把城市还给我们，仿佛归还一笔来历不明的财富，而不是一座由他们保管的城市。
城里有一万多人，包括妇女和小孩。户户大门紧闭，长官来回巡视，要屋里的人交出欠款。每家门前都有埃米尔和高级军官站岗，以清点小孩和出门的人数：付款的就让他走，付不起的就关人监狱，毫无情面可讲。

作者: 风语冰音 时间: 2004-4-3 22:14
我也是啊！这一段话说出来，天~~，我是肯定快昏过去了。觉得导演至少会写这段的吧，从现在的服装造型来看，scott导演伯伯还是挺有品位的，给了我们一个完全不同的orli造型。
我觉得，以化妆师和造型师的表现，应该至少有个奥斯卡提名吧。~~

我现在正在整理orli在学校时的舞台剧演出，真是太想看到这些表演了，而且根据剧本，orli在舞台剧中有演唱和用其他口音念台词，真遗憾不能看到。
大人如果有兴趣，可以到下面的网址看看，由orlando在学校时表演的舞台剧的具体介绍：
http://www.ka-bloom.org/forum/index.php?act=ST&f=2&t=5350&s=61044ec0138632deebf02e009f673ae5

作者: 风语冰音 时间: 2004-4-3 22:19
楼上的大人真是太强了，多谢翻译。

这里真是人才济济，我还要好好学习啊！

作者: mursili 时间: 2004-4-3 22:20
http://web.singnet.com.sg/~chewgc/ob/star_apr04_01.jpg

就是这张照片旁边的文字，偶狂ft，真是人怕出名猪怕壮，偶怀疑过国内就会登出来，哼

作者: 浊酒 时间: 2004-4-3 22:20
演唱啊,OB唱歌时什么样~~~小心心

另,谢谢lyra提供的资料

作者: 浊酒 时间: 2004-4-3 22:42
汗,这个啊,小杂志不说好话是正常的事

BS都懒得BS了,至于国内媒体,它们还能指望,不过是糊弄人的罢了

还糊弄的是没文化水平低的

多认得几个字的,它们还真糊弄不了

作者: 风语冰音 时间: 2004-4-4 00:06
浊酒大人，你说的每一句话我都同意~~亲~~

又找到一篇文章，还没来得及看，先贴出来：
Here is some information I nicked from kB a while back, in an effort to learn more about the crusades, and the KoH subject matter in particular. I'm sorry that I don't have on hand the origins for all of this material. A few paragraphs are the same as what you've posted, laconejita, but I won't break it up since the flow is pretty good. It's the super-long extended dance version, though, so grab some snacks and settle in.

To wit:

QUOTE
The conquest of the holy city of Jerusalem was the inevitable sequel to the extermination of the Christian army at Hattin. The restoration of this most holy site, and particularly the recapture of the Dome of the Rock, was the immediate goal of the victorious forces of Islam.

Nothing stood between Saladin at Hattin and total victory with the seizure of Jerusalem, except one knight.

Balian of Ibelin had escaped death at Hattin. He had fled in the company of Raymond of Tripoli. Now he begged Saladin's permission to go to Jerusalem to rescue his wife Queen Maria Comnena and their children. The Sultan granted this, on condition that Balian would no longer bear arms against him.
Once in the city, however, Balian was begged to succour his fellow Christians.

A man of honour, he asked for Saladin's advice: Saladin in turn relieved him of his obligation. And as Balian was busy arranging the defences, Saladin organized an escort for the wife of the new commander of the Christian army to return safely to Tyre.

Supported by a handful of knights and sixty freshly knighted burghers, Balian led a hopeless resistance.

Amongst the civilians who took up arms to assist the defence was at least one woman. Her name was Margaret of Beverley, who had been born while her parents were on pilgrimage to the Holy Land. Once she had reached adulthood she had retraced her parents' footsteps to the East and was caught up in the siege.

In her own words, she defended the city like a man, wearing a cooking pot as a helmet, and carrying water to the men. A missile boulder wounded her with fragments. But she survived to tell her tale and to establish herself as a remarkable woman warrior.

Saladin's army drew up outside the walls of Jerusalem on September 20. Nine days later, it was all over.

Balian's miniature army had fought with the dogged desperation of those who were beyond hope. But the Saracens outnumbered them, and had tunnelled beneath the ramparts. The fall of Jerusalem was imminent, and with that knowledge must have come the memories of what had happened the last time its defences had been breached. For the non combatants - the women and children - the worst was surely yet to come.

Balian distinguished himself with his coolness and ferocity at the last throw of the dice.

He led a deputation to Saladin begging quarter: Saladin replied only that he would return evil for evil.
Balian begged, humbling and degrading himself before the inflexible Sultan, who had not wished to attack the Holy City, but now that it was done, intended to fire out its population to the last man and woman.

Balian then made one of the most inspired speeches in military history. It was recorded by Saladin's historian, Ibn al Athir:

Know then, O Sultan, that we are infinite in number and that God alone can guess what our number is.
The inhabitants are reluctant to fight, because they hope for quarter, such as you have granted to so many others. They fear death and cling to life; but once death becomes inevitable, I swear by the God who hears us, we shall kill our women and our children, we shall burn our riches and we shall not leave you a single coin.
You will find no more women to reduce to slavery, or men to put in irons.
We shall destroy the Dome of the Rock and the Mosque al Aqsa and all the holy places.
We shall slaughter all the Moslems, to the number of five thousand, imprisoned in our walls.
We shall not leave a single beast of burden alive.
We shall come out against you, and we shall fight like people fighting for their lives.
For one of us who perishes, many of yours will fall.
We shall die free, or we shall triumph with glory.

Saladin was convinced, or at least was eager to take a path that saved both bloodshed and honour. His conditions were severe but remarkably favourable to the Christians.

The Sultan demanded ten gold dinars for each man, the same per two women, and the same amount for every ten children. Some could pay, many were unable to do so. At last, Saladin accepted a down payment of 30,000 dinars from Balian for the seven to eighteen thousand poor people of Jerusalem.

The entry to the Holy City took place on October 2, 1187, the anniversary of the very day on which Mohammed was thought to have been transported from Mecca to Jerusalem and thence to Paradise.

Alas, the occasion of religious fervour turned into a veritable meat market, as the haggling began over the payment of ransoms for the better off. The leaders became embarassed at the sight of the thousands of families patiently queuing to pay their ransoms, and so some of the sheiks and Balian began to pay for hundreds at a time, from their own purses. Even the venial Patriarch grudgingly agreed to buy off 700. This proved merely a distraction to his main aim: he fled the city soon afterwards with cart loads of jewellery and other treasure. According to Ibn al Athir, he took with him the treasures of the Dome of the Rock, the Mosque al Aqsa, the Church of the Resurrection, plus an equal quantity of money.

Saladin was asked by his sheikhs to intervene and relieve the despicable prelate of his burden, but the Sultan declined, confining his tax to the agreed ten dinar.4 Alas, the insults of Islam were too often wasted on the sensibilities of the Christians.

Saladin then freed the remainder of the poor, and restored the captive knights of Hattin to their wives. To the widows he paid a lump sum for the loss of their husbands in battle.

============================================

The Arabic accounts give us general information about Salah al- Din's attack on Jerusalem, but they fail to identify the exact locations of some of his battles and other important information about the Latins in the city, as well as about Salah al-Din's contacts with the Arab-Christian community in Jerusalem. In order to complete this picture we will utilize the chronicle of Ernoul (Chroniquc d'Er- noul). Ernoul (d. A.D. 1230) was the squire of Balian of Ibelin, the Latin leader who negotiated the surrender of Jerusalem to Salah al- Din. He was an eyewitness to the battle of Jerusalem and provides insight into what was happening within the walled city,.

Jerusalem, the capital of the Latin kingdom, had suffered a great loss of manpower as a result of Hittin. Among those captured or killed were the king, Gui of Lusignan; his counsellors; his brother Amaury, the constable of the kingdom; the grand masters of the Templars and the Hospitallers, and a large number of the knights of these two military orders. The only surviving leaders, who fled the battle to safety through Muslim lines, were Raymond of Tripoli, Reynold of Sidon, and Balian of Ibelin (referred to in Arabic sources as Balian Ibn Barzan). These men had enjoyed friendly relations with Salah al-Din and were suspected by the Latins of complicity with him. Of the three, the most important for our discussion is Balian.

Ernoul indicates that a delegation of citizens from Jerusalem went to see Salah al-Din on the day he took 'Asqalan (Jumada al-Thani, A.H. 583/September, A.D. 1187) to ask for a peaceful solution for Jerusalem. On the day of the meeting there was an eclipse of the sun, which the Latin delegates considered to be a bad omen. Never- theless, Salah al-Din offered them generous terms for the city: They were to be allowed to remain in the city temporarily, they were to retain the land within a radius of five leagues around it, and they were to receive the supplies they needed from Salah al-Din. The settlement was to remain valid until Pentecost. If the citizens of Jerusalem could obtain external help, they would remain rulers of the city; if not, they were to surrender it and remove themselves to Christian lands.

According to Ernoul, the delegation rejected this offer, saying they would never give up the city in which "the Lord died for them." Salah al-Din then vowed to take Jerusalem by force and started his march against the city.

It seems most probable that there was more than one contact between Salah al-Din and the authorities in Jerusalem, the first being in Tyre. 'Imad al-Din informs us that while at Tyre Salah al-Din summoned King Gui and the grand master of the Templars and promised both of them freedom if they helped him secure the surrender of other cities. These two did in fact later help him to secure the surrender of 'Asqalan and Gaza. Salah al-Din may at the same time also have contacted Balian of Ibelin, who was already in Tyre, and asked him to secure the surrender of Jerusalem. Ernoul mentions that while Salah al-Din was in Tyre, Balian sought his permission to go to Jerusalem in order to rescue his wife, Maria Comnena, as well as other members of his family and their possessions. Salah al-Din granted him permission to go to Jerusalem on the condition that he not bear weapons against him and that he spend only one night there.

In so doing, Salah al-Din must have hoped to use Balian as his chief negotiator for the surrender of Jerusalem. Balian ultimately did negotiate the surrender of the city, but only after he had broken his agreement with Salah al-Din and played a dramatic role in its defence.

After arriving in Jerusalem, Balian was pressed by the patriarch to remain there and to mobilize the population for its defence. At first Balian resisted, insisting that he would adhere 10 his commitment to Salah al-Din. But at the insistence ol the patriarch, who absolved him of his oath, Balian finally consented to accept the leadership of the city. His rank among the Latins was, according to Ibn al-Athir, analogous to that of a king.

Balian began immediately to consolidate the Latin forces and plan the defence of the city. According to Latin sources, he found only two knights in the city who had survived Hittin. Thus, to make up for the shortage of male fighters, he knighted fifty sons of the nobility. According to Runciman, he knighted every boy of noble origin who was over sixteen years of age; he also knighted sixty burgesses. Since money was scarce, Balian, with the blessing of the Patriarch Heraclius, stripped the silver from the roof of the Church of the Holy Sepulchre and used it, along with some church funds and money that King Henry II of England had sent to the Hospitallers, to produce a currency. He then distributed arms to every able-bodied man in the city.

As the undisputed ruler of Jerusalem, Balian is most likely to have contacted Salah al-Din once again regarding Jerusalem at 'Asqa- lan. According to Latin sources, Balian wrote him at 'Asqalan to apologize for having broken his agreement and to ask his forgiveness, which Salah al-Din gave.2

No one knows the nature of the secret correspondence between the two leaders, but the terms that Ernoul alleges Salah al-Din to have proposed, regarding the fate of Jerusalem, seem doubtful. Salah al-Din was by then well aware that Jerusalem would not be able to hold out against him for long, especially since he had isolated it almost completely. Nor would he have allowed a situation to develop in Jerusalem such as that in Tyre, which had become the centre of resistance against his forces. Furthermore, even before the capture of 'Asqalan, Salah al-Din had written to the caliph and to other relatives announcing his intention to capture the city. In one letter he stated, "The march to Jerusalem will not be delayed, for this is precisely the right time to liberate it."

Ibn al-Athir's account of the battle is more detailed. According to him, on the night of 20 Rajab, A.H. 53/25 September, A.D. 1187 Salah al-Din installed his mangonels, and by morning his machinery was functional. The Latins also installed their mangonels on the wall and started to fire their catapults. Both sides fought bravely, each considering its struggle to bc in defence of its faith. The Latin cavalry left the city daily to engage in combat with Salah al-Din's forces, and both sustained casualties.

In one of these battles a Muslim commander, 'Izz al-Din 'Isa Ibn Malik, was martyred by the Latins. His death so grieved the Muslims that they charged the Latins vehemently, forcing them away from their positions and pushing them back into the walls of the city. The Muslims crossed the moat and reached the wall. Sappers prepared to destroy it while archers gave them cover, and mangonels continued bombarding the Latins to drive them away from the wall so the sappers could complete their work. When the wall had been breached, sappers filled it witll wood.

作者: 风语冰音 时间: 2004-4-4 00:07
文章太大了，只好分开帖：

Realizing that they were on the verge of perishing, the Latin leaders met in council and agreed to surrender Jerusalem to Salah al-Din and to ask him for safe conduct. Accordingly, they sent a delegation of their leaders to speak with Salah al-Din, but he turned them away, saying that he would treat them the way their anccstors had treated the residents of Jerusalem in A.H. 492/A.D. 1099, by death and captivity. On the following day, Balian Ibn Barzan (Balian of Ibelin) left Jerusalem to discuss the future of the city and its population with Salah al-Din.

According to al-Qadi al-Fadil, the fire from the mangonels destroyed thc tops of the towers, "which were used to repel the attacks." When they collapsed, "the towers made such a noise that even the deafest among the enemy must have heard it." The defenders thus had to abandon their positions, giving the sappers a chance to accomplish their task. When the wall fell, Balian Ibn Barzan, the leader of the besieged, left the city and told Salah al-Din that Jerusalem should be taken by surrender rather than by force.

Ernoul informs us that, realizing they could not hold the city for very long, the authorities in Jerusalem held an emergency meeting, attended by the Patriarch Heraclius and Balian of Ibelin, at which they discussed their military options. The citizens' representatives and the sergeants advanced a proposal for a massive attack on Salah al-Din's forces, thus "dying honourably in defence of the city."

The patriarch rejected this proposal, however, arguing that if all the men died, the fate of the women and children in the city would be left in the hands of the Muslim forces, who would certainly convert them to Islam. He proposed instead that the city should be surrendered, and he promised that after surrendering it, the Latins would seek help from Europe. The authorities accordingly agreed, and hence dispatched Balian to discuss the terms of the surrender with Salah al-Din. According to Ernoul, Balian left the city to negotiate with Salah al-Din, and, while the talks were in progress, the Muslim forces succeeded in raising their flag on the main wall. Rejoicing, Salah al-Din turned to Balian and asked: "Why are you proposing to surrender the city? We have already captured it!" However, the Latins counter-attacked Salah al-Din's forces, driving them away from the section they had captured. Salah al-Din was so angered by this that he dismissed Balian and told him to return the following day.

When Balian returned to the city without an agreement, fear gripped the population. According to Ernoul, the citizens "crowded in the churches to pray and confess their sins, [they] beat themselves with stones and scourges, begging for God's mercy." The Latin women in the city placed tubs in front of Mount Calvary and filled them with cold water, then took their young daughters, stripped them naked, and placed them in the water up to their necks. They cut their hair and burned it in the hope of averting their shame. Meanwhile, the clergy walked in procession around the walls of the city chanting psalms and carrying the Syrian "true cross," which had been kept in the city after the "true cross" of the Latins had fallen into the hands of Salah al-Din's forces at the battle of Hittin. Ernoul reports that the entire population took part in the procession, except for the very old men, who locked themselves inside their homes.

When Balian appeared again before Salah al-Din, he asked for a general amnesty in return for the surrender of the city, but Salah al-Din rejected his request. Balian then threatened that the Latins inside the city would fight to the death: They would burn their houses, destroy the Dome of the Rock, uproot the Rock, and kill all Muslim prisoners, who were estimated to number in the thousands; they would destroy their property and kill their women and children. According to al-Qadi al-Fadil, Balian also "offered a tribute in an amount that even the most covetous could not have hoped for."

Salah al-Din met with his commanders and told them that this was an excellent opportunity to capture the city without further bloodshed. After lengthy negotiations, an agreement was reached between Salah al-Din and the Latins according to which they were granted safe conduct to leave the city, provided that each male paid a ransom of ten dinars, each female paid five dinars, and each child was ransomed for two dinars. All those who paid their ransom within forty days were allowed to leave the city, while those who could not ransom themselves were to be enslaved.

'Imad al-Din indicates that Balian offered to pay 30,000 dinars on behalf of the poor, an offer that was accepted, and the city was at last surrendered on Friday, 27 Rajab, A.H. 583/2 October, A.D. 1187. The twenty-seventh of Rajab was the anniversary of al-Mi'raj, through which Jerusalem had become a part of Islamic history and piety . When Salah al-Din entered Jerusalem triumphantly, he immediately released the Muslim prisoners, who, according to Ibn Shaddad, numbered close to 3,ooo. The newly released captives were later rewarded with the homes vacated by the Latins.

Meanwhile, the Latins started to prepare for their departure. They began to sell their property and possessions at very low prices to the merchants in Salah al-Din's army, as well as to native Christians. According to 'Imad al-Din, they stripped the ornaments from their churches, carrying with them vases of gold and silver and silk- and gold-embroidered curtains as well as church treasures. The Patriarch Heraclius collected and carried away gold plating, gold and silver jewelry, and other arteacts from the Church of the Holy Sepulchre.

In order to control the departing population, Salah al-Din ordered that all the gates of Jerusalem be temporarily closed. At each gate a commander was appointed to control the movement of the Latins and to ensure that only those who had paid ransom could leave. Persons were employed inside the city to take a census. 'Imad al- Din says that Egyptian and Syrian officers were appointed to collect the payments and to give the departing Latins receipts that were to be submitted at the gate before leaving the city. Although this sounds like good administration, at the time the Latins were being counted and were making their departure, the city was in a state of chaos and there was much mismanagement of the ransom money collected. The grand masters of the Templars and Hospitallers were approached to donate money for the release of poor Latins, but when they resisted, a riot almost erupted and they were forced to contribute to the ransom.

There were examples of magnanimity on the part of the Muslim victors, however. The patriarch and Balian asked Salah al-Din to set some slaves free. Accordingly, he freed 700 slaves on behalf of the patriarch and 500 on behalf of Balian. Al-Malik al-'Adil, Salah al-Din's brother, asked him to release 1,000 slaves on his behalf and was granted his request. Furthermore, Salah al-Din sent his guard throughout the city to announce that all old people who could not pay would be allowed to leave the city: These came forth from the Postern of St. Lazar, and their departure lasted from the rising of the sun until night fell." Salah al-Din also allowed many noble women of Jerusalem to leave without ransom. Among them was Queen Sibyl, who left unhindered with all her entourage. Salah al-Din even granted her safe conduct to visit her captive husband in Nablus. The widow of Renaud of Chatillon was also released, as well as a Byzantine princess who had led a monastic life in Jerusalem and who was allowed to leave with all her entourage without paying a ransom. Some of Salah al-Din's commanders ransomed groups who they claimed belonged to their iqta' For example, the ruler of al-Bira asked for the release of 500 Armenians, and Muzaffar al-Din Ibn 'Ali Kuchuk asked for the release of 1,000, claiming that they had come from Edessa. Salah al-Din granted his request.

After the exodus of all those Latins who could leave, 15,000 individuals remained in the city. According to Imad al-Din, 7,000 of them were men and 8,000 were women and children. All were enslaved.

Emoul, by now a Latin refugee, indicated that the ransomed refugees were assembled in three groups. One was placed in the custody of the Templars and another in that of the Hospitallers, while Balian and Patriarch Heraclius took charge of the third. Salah al-Din assigned each group fifty of his officers to ensure their safe arrival in territories held by the Christians. One chronicler gives Salah al-Din's officers credit for their humane treatment of thc refugees, noting that these officers, " who could not endure the suffenng of the refugees, ordered their squires to dismount and set aged Christans upon their steeds. Some of them even carried Christian children in their arms."

The second bit here (from the line break) is from:
http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/med/salahdin.html

作者: 浊酒 时间: 2004-4-4 00:15
从这些资料看,天国这个电影,在编剧上是大有可为
Balian这个人物,如果剧本编得水准过硬的话,也是很有发挥空间滴
同时,也极有难度

对OB将是一个磨练,一个考验

表过,相信这样的角色(如果剧本编得好,这是总的大前题),对OB来说,应是他期望的角色
会有难度,但也给了他一个发展的空间

作者: lilyday 时间: 2004-4-5 14:37
偶觉得Oril现在开始扮演"天国"和"凯利党"里面外形不是很好看(8过偶们OB的条件,想难看也比较难呀!)是希望转变人们的看法,把影迷的注意力从他的外表更多的转移到他的演技上来!(开玩笑呀!人家好歹也是英国国家剧院的青年演员,水平也是不一般的说!)看来偶们开花对自己的认识还是很清醒的!越来越喜欢他了.......

作者: escada 时间: 2004-4-6 11:33
觉得这张照片有点像皮特

欢迎光临 Orlando Bloom中文站论坛 (http://www.orlandobloom.cn/forum/)